8 Bits

8 Bits with Jeremy Sinclair!

• Brandon • Season 2 • Episode 6

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Jeremy is a .NET Developer focusing on Windows! 

Watch the Video Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKok6Lp38ms

Follow Jeremy Sinclair on Twitter: https://twitter.com/sinclairinat0r
Follow Chloe on Twitter: https://twitter.com/ChloeCondon
Follow Brandon on Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheCodeTraveler

Chloe Condon:

Hey, it's 1pm PST as you know, that means it is a bear. With me, you're ready to avoid meat eating. Over here, Brandon Minnick. Hi, Brandon.

Brandon Minnick:

Hi, everybody. Great to see you again, as always. Happy Wednesday.

Chloe Condon:

Happy Wednesday. What a crazy week it is. I've started my week off with the Microsoft Student Ambassador hackathon. That's happening. We're doing a social good idea hackathon. So my heart is very full with all these positive things that are being built and eventually sent out into the world. I truly feel like Whitney Houston, I believe that children are future right now. These students make me very proud to be mentoring the MSA is have you worked with the msps? Before Brandon,

Brandon Minnick:

I did I actually, I snuck into the the events. This week, I gave a, I guess I was I was on a panel, there was four of us. And we all gave our tips and tricks for hosting workshops. Got to talk about how we can make sure workshops are inclusive and not just inclusive for different levels of experience. Because as we know, everybody can join a workshop, whether they have never written a line of code in their life to being a total expert, or there's also the inclusive inclusivity of making sure folks with different backgrounds, different disabilities, that can all successfully attend the workshop as well. So it was really cool. And yeah, I mean, the questions we got from the students for graded it, it's so true, they really do. make you proud, make you excited for the future. Yeah,

Chloe Condon:

I had a really fun time yesterday, I got to moderate and sit in on a talk by Margaret price, who works here at Microsoft to talk all about inclusive design. And it really opened my eyes, so much so that later in the day yesterday, my dad just bought a soda stream. And if you're not familiar, so two streams are those devices that you can make sparkling water at home, because he's been drinking a little too much liquor. So he wants to save some money. My dad put together this soda stream, and we wanted to do a video call, but the video calling app that we were using required one of those Android features where there's a button in the center, but there's no directions. And you either have to swipe left or right to answer it. And that was a really interesting moment after hearing that inclusive design talk earlier in the day. Because I thought to myself, Oh, like there's no directions. There's no onboarding to tell my dad who is 76 not great at technology, how to answer this. So it made me start thinking about what are some ways to make sure that I'm being inclusive with the apps and the products that I designed to make sure, like, obviously, something that Margaret talked about was it's hard to account for everyone to design for everyone. And accessibility and inclusivity are two very different things. But I've been inclusivity on the mind this week, Brandon?

Brandon Minnick:

Oh, yeah, and it good. It's important. And I think that's a topic that should be at the forefront of all of our minds. Because too often it's it's more of an afterthought. And the problem with accessibility inclusivity being an afterthought is that it's so much harder to say fix or implement after you've completed the project that you're working on. Whereas if you had started from or started down that road from the beginning, then it really doesn't take much more effort. It's just kind of like, oh, let's keep this in mind. And oh, yeah, this color palette, it looks like that would be tough for people who are colorblind. And then you can quickly check it out. And then you haven't designed your whole app or your whole website with a bad color palette and have to redo it later. And so yeah, kudos, kudos to you for keeping it top of mind. And also everybody out there, let's let's make sure we're always, always being inclusive, always being sure we can have accessible apps accessible websites, for everything we make.

Chloe Condon:

It's important to have those people in the room for the decision making to and one of the examples that I think of really often is, you know, we're all software engineers. And we typically if we're not freelancing, or doing a couple different side jobs, we have one job and a lot of times applications will be built where there's one work location, one home location, but when we're thinking of lower income demographics of other industries, like I come from theater where people have multiple jobs at once. Sometimes it's worth having a voice in the room saying, Hey, you know, we're designing this for this kind of, you know, demographic or this kind of person. Maybe there should be multiple work locations, or maybe this is an app for children and maybe they come from divorced household should we have two home locations. So there's really interesting thing to Margaret talk about, like, if you're not getting the full perspective of who your users are and how you're using it, you're not really getting the full picture of how your app can be impactful. So now I'm almost designing backwards. I'm like, Alright, so am I being inclusive with colorblindness and being inclusive for people who aren't great at technology? And of course, it can become overwhelming, but super important to think about when we're designing these apps. And yeah, I wish I could have caught your workshop talk, Brandon.

Brandon Minnick:

It was a first thing Tuesday morning, which was our Monday since Monday was a holiday here in the US. But yeah, I always say if, if a UI isn't intuitive, if, for example, if the user can't figure it out, just by looking at it, it's broken. And people hate that I say that. But it's true. Because if I need to explain to you how to use my app, or how to use my website, and you need to go through a tutorial first, then your UX is broken. And I should be able to do it, intuitively figure it out. And yeah, like you said, with having to swipe to do something, but it doesn't give you I guess you can put arrows on the screen or say like swipe here, kind of have that first run experience that maybe fades away after the user uses it a couple of successful times. But yeah, we need to make sure we keep an eye on that.

Chloe Condon:

Yeah. inclusivity for all the people. Well, any other news you want to talk about Brandon, before we bring in our super special guest today? We've got good Wednesday?

Brandon Minnick:

Yeah. Now let's let's bring him in. Cuz he's, he's one of my favorite people. So I can't wait to

Jeremy Sinclair:

honor.

Brandon Minnick:

Well, so our guest this week is Jeremy Sinclair, he and I, we go back we are will say old time Xamarin developers from back in the day. And that's how I got to know Jeremy. And he's does just amazing work. So let's bring him in and let him tell us all about it. Welcome to the show. Jeremy.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Thank you all for having me.

Chloe Condon:

And we already have a fan in the comments we have. Tom says very excited. My friend Jeremy is on we are to Sean are so so excited. Jeremy, I haven't seen you. Orlando live.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Live 360. Yeah. Such great times back when we could travel.

Chloe Condon:

Back when we could meet in person. What have you been up to these days? Jeremy working from home, I assume?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yeah, we're working from home. keeping myself busy. just cruising Twitter, doing what I do. tweeting every awesome thing that I find out on the internet and just doing all kinds of random stuff, just to keep me occupied and everyone excited.

Chloe Condon:

If you're not following Jeremy on Twitter, you should handle is below I always get a smile on my face on all the wonderful funny things you post on Instagram to Jeremy so it's a good follow everyone.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Keep it interesting.

Chloe Condon:

Jeremy and for folks who are new to the Sinclair inator brand, tell us a little bit about what you do who you are until the lovely folks at home? Who were who were chatting with today who are going to ask these tough eight questions.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yes, so my name is Jeremy Sinclair, I am an enterprise dotnet developer. I mostly do back end dotnet ASP. NET Core development, SharePoint development. But when I'm outside of work, I just try to do a lot of native development to keep my mind going. And I do a lot of PowerShell also.

Chloe Condon:

And I'm just remembering now Jeremy, we totally forgot the lead in here was you and I met at build a few years ago and we were c seven C's. There are a lot of fun videos of that online that people can check out of Jeremy interviewing some fun people and myself doing I think we have a coffee chat that we did together. Laura the whole build playgrounds. I call it a playground because it really kind of felt like a theme park. Um, were you able to attend any of the online build this year?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, absolutely. That was that was actually very exciting because I felt like since this year was also the first year that I became a Windows Insider MVP. Yay. Thank you, thank you. There was a there's a lot of stuff that I was excited to hear about. Build. And I really thought it was really interesting to see it happened online because I felt like I was back in my zone. Where I normally go through these courses are the ones that really catch my eye, catch my eye and tweet out all the amazing bits and pieces of it for everyone else to find out.

Chloe Condon:

And there was this really cool visual during build that I saw. I don't remember who tweeted it, but it was like a info kind of a visual graphic of all the people who tweeted at build and all the people connected and Jeremy had I'm not kidding, y'all like it was this dot with like, a million lines coming off of it. Worse of Twitter info for build. And so how did you become a Windows Insider? Do you just wake up one day and you become one? Or is that like a climb a mountain for and achieve? You know, after 20 years of study?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Well, once upon a time there was this device called the windows. Yeah. That's that's what got me into mobile development. Actually, C sharp is the reason. And eventually when they had the Windows Phone eight previews and the windows 10 Mobile insider builds. That's when I got got in on it. And was it was there the beginning of Windows 10. So I love my preview builds and the feedback I'm able to give and help out the rest of the teams. I love bleeding edge everything so I'm used to I'm ready. Ready

Chloe Condon:

for this new device that's coming out.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, you mean that a surface duo that I have coming for me tomorrow? Tomorrow? Yeah,

Brandon Minnick:

yeah. versity stream show tomorrow.

Chloe Condon:

Where's it very jealous. I keep telling everyone I'm gonna make a little book skin for mine and walk around like I'm reading a book everywhere.

Jeremy Sinclair:

I feel like that would work for you. Yeah.

Chloe Condon:

Well, that's super exciting. You must be like checking the door every five minutes, just like

Jeremy Sinclair:

you should have seen my face when I saw was the last week or a few weeks ago. Others received their units. I'm checking FedEx. Do I become in for me? Yes.

Brandon Minnick:

Go to the tracking website. hitting refresh, refresh. Yo, this thing here yet?

Chloe Condon:

I've totally skipped over some really big important Microsoft music that came out yesterday a little bit unexpectedly but the new Xbox looks freaking

Unknown:

rad, right?

Jeremy Sinclair:

I like those prices. Those prices are good. That's because I know a lot of people were really worried about, you know, the series x costing like six 700 bucks. But that, that 499. That's that's doable. And the the s that I might actually, I don't know, I'm still I'm still rolling with my original Xbox One, like xbox one one terabyte, like, I'm keeping an old school until that thing, that thing just decides to not work. It's been doing well. You know,

Chloe Condon:

what I like even more than the price is are the memes that have come out because so one was like, john Cusack holding the radio up, like and say anything. And he's holding up the Xbox. And my, my favorite one is the SpongeBob meme, where it's SpongeBob and Patrick lips open and then they put some eyes on the Xbox.

Jeremy Sinclair:

The makers they're around full force on

Chloe Condon:

the Xbox account on Twitter, you're sleeping on that account, because it is a really, really funny, wonderful account that has been tweeting out all these hilarious memes. And I think that they handled yesterday really well. If you haven't gotten down, looked at their tweets yesterday, I highly recommend checking.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yeah, I like to have a sense of humor. is you got it you gotta have adoring days.

Brandon Minnick:

Yeah, right. Like you just have to roll with it. Because if you get defensive and you're like, no, don't put eyeballs on our product. Look what what are you so upset about this?

Chloe Condon:

Because we always talk about theme parks on the show every single time without fail. They're currently building a velociraptor rollercoaster at Universal Orlando and they haven't really posted anything public about it. So someone posted this photo of like a crane lifting up like a velociraptor. And it's quite the coaster they're building and I'm I think I saw the universal account tweet like the side eye emoji just like Look over there. There's nothing to see here. about, well, shall we get into the questions do they fit time? I think it's about that time. And for those of you who are not, who are maybe new or have not joined us before, on this show eight bits, we have the same format each time with our guests, which is that we have the same seven questions that we asked each time and then we have an eight bonus question that is based off of our guests think inside the Actor's Studio, but a little more techie, tech, nostalgia, nerdy kind of thing. So without further ado, Jeremy, we will give you the first question, which is what is your earliest memory of tech?

Jeremy Sinclair:

So mom's earliest memory of tech is seeing my my dad's computer this think it was a 286 at the time and those little input switcher things underneath the monitor repress the little lever the turn them the entire machine on, as you remember playing in DOS nukem all those fun old school games?

Chloe Condon:

Yeah, I still vividly remember a lot of the sounds of those devices. Like I even remember like my dad's printer sound very clearly. The paper

Brandon Minnick:

that's right, cuz Yeah, everything was like, let's face it flops, like the game noses or like, the blue. And it totally worked.

Jeremy Sinclair:

I even remember having to type in like meme maker to get up to that 640 k of conventional memory. All of those those days, just wanted to play the game. And he had to enter all these commands just for it to work. Because Because of that, I'm more of a command line person.

Brandon Minnick:

Our, our first computer upgrade, because we had older computers. And then this was in the 90s when like gateway was the big computer dealer. And we bought like, top of the line gateway PC, and it had an eight gigabyte hard drive. Never thinking there's no way we'll ever fill this eight gigabyte hard drive. And now I'm like, I need at least a terabyte for work. Yeah.

Chloe Condon:

I feel like did you guys ever play, putt putt or any of those early childhood education games? Or like pajama Sam? We're gonna we're gonna chels kind of in that genre, but for me, like I went from the old black and white, you know, math that my dad got from the college that he did wordprocessing arm to go into a friend's house who had a PC and I had never seen like a color game before like, and seeing this like purple car on the screen that could talk to me versus just like a quick sound bite or just like a bleep bloop was just like I have to come to your house every day. I am so sorry. I need to play this game I need to understand so I love it these games like bringing folks like us into this into this computing world. So which one did you say was your favorite Jeremy

Jeremy Sinclair:

my favorite. Oh, that's that's tough because oh no, I believe I will go with I'll go to Duke Nukem.

Chloe Condon:

Duke Nukem Okay, yeah.

Jeremy Sinclair:

I'll put Commander Keen in second place that that's up there too. Oh, wow. Back

Brandon Minnick:

coming back.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Major striker all this fun. A podgy Apogee I can remember how to pronounce it. Oh, wow. So

Brandon Minnick:

forgot about all this stuff.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, yeah.

Chloe Condon:

I watched a live stream of y'all playing those just like going back. Playing all these games man the chat saying wolfen Stein.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, yeah. So me, this is a funny story. So my mother and I used to play Wolf and Stein. And she used to get us frustrated with the game as I did. It was so hilarious to see her get so competitive. wanted the gun down these dudes that I couldn't. Couldn't be

Chloe Condon:

your mom live stream this game?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Probably not.

Chloe Condon:

My dad and Mario Tennis. Which is a great segue into our next question, which is what is the last piece of technology or hardware that you bought?

Jeremy Sinclair:

You already know that surface duo but I'll go Before that, before that was my Surface Pro X. Okay, that I'm currently using. Ooh, and look at cameras phenomenal.

Chloe Condon:

Look at those awesome headphones that you have what brand nirbhay Jeremy,

Jeremy Sinclair:

they happen to be surface. Surface though. This is funny because this device is the first surface device I've ever bought.

Chloe Condon:

Interesting. Okay, yeah.

Jeremy Sinclair:

And for the added reason of, hey, Microsoft's finally making and windows on ARM PC, so I had to hop in on it.

Brandon Minnick:

Yeah, yeah. And as a as a fellow C sharp Visual Studio dev has, how's it holding up for for coding for I assume you're using with your day to day?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, yeah. So I will say that. If you use envision if you want to use Visual Studio, just don't expect to have fun compiling UDP applications, just just know. But other than that, I mean, we have dotnet, five previews that are native windows arm 64 support, so I can easily compile those and run this. And it runs really, really awesome. Now vs VS code. There's a lot of stuff that I use this for. Just as my primary device. I can, if it runs on it, I'm going to try to run it. Oh, Ws l two. I had to do a shameless plug on that. Because saying, Who to run so flawlessly. For me. I've compiled recompile. The kernel, Linux kernel. In Ws l two on my Surface Pro X. Wow. Yeah. Well, yeah.

Chloe Condon:

Today, I learned we had someone in the chat say back on our last question. Back in my day, we had Pong and we liked it. We played it uphill both ways.

Jeremy Sinclair:

super old school on me.

Chloe Condon:

I'm actually a really big fan of those service headphones. And I promise this isn't a commercial. But I wear them around my house. And sometimes I put the noise cancellation all the way up and my boyfriend will pat me on the shoulder and I will legitimately be wonderful back when I was on airplanes. And I had to drown out crying baby sounds in an airport or even sometimes just walking down the street. But it does get kind of creepy. You feel like can't even hear the leaves crunching under your feet when you're walking.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yeah. Big things I like about the service headphones that the noise cancellation is definitely on point. Yeah, my vacation. Oh, yes. is if you want just that ambient noise to drown out things you can enhance it. Is these headphones are really awesome. Yeah. Just the amount of power to them. I can really where I'm the entire day. So can't get any better. Cuz I

Chloe Condon:

get a lot of questions in the Bay Area back when I was out a lot more like oh, Richard, those headphones. They look cool. But whenever I'm in Seattle. I'm like, Oh, that must be a Microsoft employee there. All right. Our next question here to me is what technology do you love?

Jeremy Sinclair:

I love.net C sharp dotnet Everything is there. The reason I like it is because I feel like I can go anywhere with it. I learned PowerShell first before I learned C sharp. So being able to translate a lot of my ideas back and forth. And by create some, some library and I want to share it for different platforms. My code reuse is up because I don't have to recreate everything over and over and over again. So that's my favorite.

Brandon Minnick:

I couldn't agree more.

Unknown:

Get to the choir here but Brandon,

Chloe Condon:

I have to ask how did the two of you both get like pulled into the siren song of dotnet because I have yet to really play that much art. So pitch me it's Shark Tank.

Unknown:

I'm a shark

Brandon Minnick:

first. So my my first introduction to dotnet was my first job out of college. So I went to University of Florida and they exclusively teach Java. And when I graduated, my first job was using C sharp. And it was back then it was a pretty easy transition. Because I mean, let's be honest, like C sharp was basically Java when it first came out of us. I think it's like nicknamed Microsoft Java, right? I mean, the good news is Since then, the C sharp team does an amazing job because C sharp nine coming out all these amazing new features that Java is now kind of catching up to us. But but so that was just total luck. And then, as I grew in my career, and eventually discovered Xamarin, well, that was fret. That was when like that mobile wave was happening. So I really wanted to get into mobile, I was a developer, I knew how to code. And specifically, I knew C sharp. But to make an iOS and Android app, you had to know, well, back then it was Objective C. And Java was like, Well, I know Java, it looks at Objective C, and it's like, oh, I want to learn this language. I guess I'll try it. Like I made a calculator app like, now a lot of us do for our first first apps. But yeah, and then I was poking around, and I found this company with a funny name called Xamarin. I was like, what do they do? And it was like, native iOS and Android apps in C sharp, I was like, Oh, yeah, that's exactly what I want and started playing around with it. It's like this is a pretty cool tool ended up working there. And what I love about or love the most about dotnet, and C sharp now is how the ecosystem has grown. So obviously, Microsoft acquired us acquired Xamarin. So we have a first class mobile experience that we are already had first class web experiences and desktop experiences. And now we have ml, dotnet, and IoT. So there's, there's really nothing you can't do as a C sharp dotnet developer these days. And I struggled to find an excuse to leave it, you know, when somebody's like, let's work on this ml project. They're like, we should do it in Python, like, Well, actually,

Unknown:

you know, there's

Brandon Minnick:

ml dotnet, we're gonna shout over here. And everything just keeps working. They keep adding new features to it. So not only do I love the language, love all the features, I love strongly typed languages, in particular, with a little bit of functional programming sprinkled in beautiful, it but now it's like, I can do everything I need. And kind of like Jeremy mentioned earlier, you can share code across all these apps. So my back end can share code with my mobile app can share code with my website, if I wanted to run an IoT board, part of that project to like, all that is all just C sharp. And so. So yeah, got me all excited.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Well, that's actually kind of a very similar story. So after, well, I was still in college, at the time, started as an intern at the current place I'm at, and I was a systems engineer. And, you know, we had a lot of systems, I like to automate things and happened across PowerShell, just randomly. So I installed it and saw everything that I could do with it, learned it, built some crazy scripts to handle like different Exchange servers and SQL servers and aggregate the data. And that was my way in. And the more I, you know, I loved PowerShell and also had some knowledge of PHP on the side. It was around that time when Windows Phone seven was starting to come out. And I wanted to develop, like I can, I'm doing this scripting over here. I'm automating this, I want to get a phone and I want to develop for it. And that's that's how I really got into more of dotnet. Then I happen to transfer over to the position of Matt now the dotnet web developer, essentially and mono touch and mono droid before Xamarin. Yeah,

Brandon Minnick:

way back in the day, because like,

Jeremy Sinclair:

like you said, I I wanted to develop for all the devices. But there was no way that I was going to pick up Java and especially Objective C that that one blew my mind. Like, yeah, I yeah, I want to use dotnet for this.

Chloe Condon:

Very cool well as the shark. I will. I'll give you thanks.

Jeremy Sinclair:

We got the dotnet.

Chloe Condon:

This Python JavaScript girl will defer to you guys. That's me. So if there was like a beginner project, well, maybe Brandon, you have a good answer for this because you've been working with PJ on some dotnet stuff, right? What's a good kind of intro beginner project? Maybe some of our students are, um, essays are watching that they could get started with.

Brandon Minnick:

Yeah. And so when just to fill anybody in who missed our episode, we had a guest PJ met. So Ashley, he'll be coming back in a couple weeks. Can't wait to see him again. But yeah, he and I have been working on a side project where he's building a website in ASP. NET Core. And the way this kind of came about was I recommended a PJ or ask PJ rather. So what what do you wish existed that we can build? Because the beauty with software is, yeah, we do have software's we can build anything? Well, almost anything, obey the laws of physics and whatnot. But But yeah, I found when I was learning, specifically Xamarin, I was working on an app that's for a website called Monday monday.com. It's now available in the iOS and Android app stores, as Pandey. And it was because I wanted to make a mobile app for this website. And that passion for this project is what pushed me to learn more and to use the framework and write more code and to get things working. And so yeah, my recommendation is think of something you wish existed. I mean, keep it simple, you know, don't, don't try to create the next Facebook or next billion dollar company just like, What's something in your life, that's mildly inconvenient that could be improved with maybe a website, maybe it's a mobile app, and then start working towards that we have great resources on Microsoft learn. We have a whole suite of C sharp tutorials that I helped record with colleagues, Scott, hanselman, and Matt soak up. They're literally called C sharp 101. So if you type in C sharp, like the hashtag 101, you'll see a bunch of YouTube videos where you can start learning the basics of the language C sharp, you can learn the basics of creating websites, and ASP. NET Core, you can learn the basics of creating mobile apps with Xamarin. And even more, there's also windows and IoT stuff in there. So yeah, check it out. But first have that project in mind because it gets kind of stale, just reading tutorials and you know, created a calculator app. Nobody's nobody's excited to create a calculator app. But if maybe you want to create something to make your life better. You're gonna want to keep working on that. Yeah, for? Well, I'll

Chloe Condon:

give a little teaser for peaches episode in a couple of weeks, a may or may not be working on a little Twitter bot with PJ that may or may not have to do with a country music singer. I've had

Brandon Minnick:

Jonas in two weeks.

Chloe Condon:

Two weeks. But Jeremy, question for you. What technology? Do you hate?

Jeremy Sinclair:

java script. I'm gonna get. I'm gonna get reamed for this one. But it's, I'll say this. I have a dislike for it. Probably because it's evolved so much. And I haven't kept up with it.

Unknown:

Okay,

Jeremy Sinclair:

that's so it's really an issue of me staying up on it. And just how much the language has has changed. The there's a lot of random JavaScript stuff, I have to kind of figure out and make work. And when I actually have to do it, I end up making it 1000 times harder than it actually is. Like NPM package that does it for me that I find out after the fact. But I will say that being able to use blazer just that just gives me a sigh of relief.

Chloe Condon:

JavaScript is like a what's the word? I'm looking for? Going through like a makeover too often for you. It's like reinventing itself to

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, it Yeah, it's it's, I guess you have JavaScript and yes, which I actually like TypeScript. I haven't played with it in depth, but it feels like TypeScript is the my ideal language to use since it compiles down to JavaScript. But I don't explicitly have to use, you know, the full JavaScript, I have the type safety, that that's actually my ideal. But when it comes to debugging JavaScript and browsers and figuring out why things aren't working, and you end up going down a rabbit hole, ultimately needing to hack something together or take something completely out for the work. That's what makes me want to pull my hair out.

Chloe Condon:

We've got a blazer hype team in the chat right now. Our blazer

Jeremy Sinclair:

is a blazer because I was doing something with one of my projects. And I needed like a little. I can't even think of a word of it like a little wizard. And there was a component that was using with a jQuery component. And for me, to tie it into what I was doing with my MVC, it was just there was I had to put something on every single page. And it felt like I was making it more clunky for no reason. And it comes blazer. And then I realized that I can bring up all of that code out and do it all with C sharp, that that sold me completely. Well, that's just my Yeah, this is this is my own personal preference. Because if I can do an A dotnet, I want I want it done and dotnet. I don't want, I don't really like to go through four or five different things. Like, I know CSS is something that is needed. That's out of my wheelhouse. That's, that's a whole other journey that continuously evolves on its own also. But I'll say I give big ups to the JavaScript community because keeping up with that, yo. Keep your strong because it keeps evolving.

Chloe Condon:

Yeah, so my my next question, which is not on the list is Brandon Jeremy after children places dumb, Are y'all gonna go get some dotnet tattoos together babies and like dotnet friendship tattoos? Love this language.

Jeremy Sinclair:

We'll see about that.

Chloe Condon:

Maybe at a conference or something y'all can? Yeah. Our next question here is what other profession would you want to attempt?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Oh, yeah, another profession. I would love to attend, especially if I wasn't doing full time dinette development, I would go down the music. Music Production realm. Yeah, back in high school. Me in fruity loops. Before it was FL Studio. We made some, we made some fire. It was, ah, I wish I could go back to those days because I could just sit and think of beats all day. And just get out my keyboard and mouse and create music without knowing how to play any musical instrument.

Chloe Condon:

Yeah. Have you considered there's a lot of conferences and events that I've attended will where they'll have like a DJ who's live coding and kind of combining music with code Have you considered combining your passions of all or maybe making music dotnet thing?

Jeremy Sinclair:

I at some point thought about it, but then that means I'd have to get the lot of the prerequisites down in order in terms of generating audio. All that good stuff before I get even go down that path that besides other software companies have, you know, obviously way more experienced that made some fantastic, you know, products that I can just use.

Chloe Condon:

Yeah, I waited for someone to make some like Windows early windows 9598. Girl Talk like albums where you're like, you've got mail from like AOL that vaporware.

Jeremy Sinclair:

So someone has to do this.

Chloe Condon:

I'll get on that immediately.

Brandon Minnick:

Anybody who's watching if you pull this together, we will have you on the show.

Chloe Condon:

I did get tagged. I think it was New Year's last year. Someone named DJ Clippy anytime. There was someone on stage with a big windows green background like DJing with Clippy on stage, and I was like

Unknown:

Yeah.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Where have you been all my life? DJ Clippy that is awesome.

Brandon Minnick:

We didn't know we needed music save us from 2020 you were

Chloe Condon:

there. But have you dabbled at all with music and tech stuff yet, Brandon?

Brandon Minnick:

I haven't. I mean, yeah, I grew up as a percussionist. So I did concert percussion. I marched on drumline in high school, I had a drum set until I had to move to San Francisco and I got a job at Xamarin. Because you can't really have a drum set in a studio apartment. Well, I guess, my neighbor, but I wouldn't, cuz that's rude to your neighbors. So. But no, I haven't done anything with mixing in technology, because that that could be kind of cool. Like, you could probably build your own pedals you could build your own. Probably amplifiers and mixers, as well, as I should say, my because my background, I did computer hardware engineering when I was in college, which is all basically designing processors. And so you have to learn all about this. Yeah, right, like Fourier transforms. And also, so all sorts of Euler equations and methods, but uh, No, I haven't I don't I don't have a good excuse.

Chloe Condon:

I feel like are the two of you familiar? Again, we're as as as per usual, we're we have to mention a musical on the show. Have either of you seen runs before? or heard the musical from the musical, right? Yeah. I feel like my first intro to that kind of like digital interactive music stuff was Maureen in rent when she sings over the moon because this was like the 80s 90s I want to say, so she had a microphone with these pedals where she would be like, she'd sing these lyrics like over the moon and then she'd like push the pedal and be like, weird and I was like that is the coolest thing in like at home make your own over the moon track app off to hit up Broadway for that one.

Jeremy Sinclair:

So many cool idea. Well, I

Chloe Condon:

think I get very inspired from artists like Girl Talk artists that like remix there's also I can't think of their name but that YouTube channel that remixes all the sounds and songs and and audio quotes like the double rainbow song like,

Unknown:

Oh, yeah,

Chloe Condon:

yes. Late, like Obama to sing or like.

Unknown:

Yeah.

Chloe Condon:

I feel like that's my next level of like, technical prowess is like, Alright, I did the musical theater thing. I did the coding thing. Now I need to figure out how to auto tune like, Oh, man. Well, Antoine, our next question here. Let's see we just did what profession Would you like to attend? What profession would you not like to attempt Jeremy?

Jeremy Sinclair:

I would not want to attempt to being a chef. That is one thing. I am not amazing at cooking. But I can cook a mean salmon fillet

Chloe Condon:

a mean salmon? And how did you learn how to cook salmon out of all of these foods? Why salmon?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Because I was watching an anime one day. It was called Food Wars. And the food on there was just so phenomenal. They're going through step by step. They were making it and I just got hungry. So I'm like, you know, we're gonna try this. So please examine

Chloe Condon:

the enemy where they they actually go through the rescue. So you're able to follow along in the anime.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Sort of like they they'll come up with these dishes and they'll go step by step. Well sort of step by step on how they have the ingredients in them. But I just saw this this one episode, they were doing something brilliant with salmon and I was just really hungry. So I just made a simple salmon fillet and like okay, we will roll with this.

Chloe Condon:

What you're saying is we need to find you more anime that focuses on delicious food. I mean, have you seen spirited away because there's a lot of yummy food and Spirited Away that

Jeremy Sinclair:

I have seen way too much anime.

Brandon Minnick:

I just tried to watch spirit away the other night, but for whatever reason, the captions weren't working. So I didn't get too far. I mean, I did take Japanese in high school but I am not fluid by any means like oh wait Yeah, I could read. I know I remember the alphabet. I love katakana cuz it's just basically anglicised words brought into Japanese and I can sound them out but kanji I didn't make it too soon though Oh, I'll catch up,

Chloe Condon:

I identify specifically during shelter in place with with the no face character eating just like inhaling all the food. That means just eating eating a box full of chicken nuggets.

Jeremy Sinclair:

no shame in that

Chloe Condon:

relatable content. So other than salmon, which we know exists of what technology Do you wish existed from film or television.

Jeremy Sinclair:

So what I really wish existed would be the, the VR so that immersive, immersive VR where you put on the device, and you're in this entirely different virtual environment, fully immersed in it. So you can go to stores interact with other people, and just live out your entire imagination. Like that would be one of the coolest things ever to experience.

Chloe Condon:

So almost like a simulation where like, like we're talking Westworld, we're talking like Ready Player One kind of scenario like like, Yeah, tell the difference at all?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Mm hmm. Like even. And I'm gonna bring up Black Mirror because it was one of those episodes, like one of the more but one of the better episodes where you just weren't scared. But I think that would be so. So cool. Just to see how far the use of that tech could improve the lives of others. If it existed at to that extent.

Chloe Condon:

Someone in our chat just mentioned upload on Amazon and I agree very similar to upload.

Brandon Minnick:

I've been meaning to watch that.

Chloe Condon:

Oh, yes. Very interesting commentary on on the afterlife and simulation. I think are you are you referencing Jeremy the sand dune pero episode in particular? Because I think you may be the second person to to mention that. I think we had someone recently the one with the the two two women who meet in the simulation.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yeah, that was awesome.

Chloe Condon:

Just visually really beautiful. And also just such a beautiful story we actually have in our home of it because I've mentioned on the show before I saw my boyfriend watch it on mute on an airplane. And I was kind of looking over and I was like you watching that's so cool. But what a great example of like, how that kind of technology beyond just fun can like provide. Yeah, like an afterlife experience.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yeah, that just blew my mind that I would love to see that technology exists one day.

Chloe Condon:

And it's and they got to choose 80s for their like era. So I'm so here.

Jeremy Sinclair:

I'm a big 80s fan. Barely born in the 80s but

Chloe Condon:

Okay, so I got really creative with our ad hoc question for our guest today. So hopefully it's not too obscure, but I feel like Jeremy This is very nice and specific to your interest. So you'll have some opinions here. So out of all your favorite anime like your top five top three anime that you watch which one would you want to sample sounds from for REMAX. Like if you were to do like music like just like a you can pick from different enemies too. But which one would you like pull from?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Hmm. I'd probably pull from lacrosse, lacrosse. Yeah. lacrosse if, let's say in America, the first season was robotech. Okay, so the first season of robotech was lacrosse. And the soundtrack from the original lacrosse enemy. It was just phenomenal. Like I almost did a remix of one of the themes. I didn't do it but it was just in my mind playing. So I might do that one day just just because he brought it up dropping first. The other one I would use. I'd use a you have to show that's one of my favorite anime probably the only one of watched twice and it has over 100 episodes

Unknown:

wow yeah

Jeremy Sinclair:

I don't play when it comes on the sound

Chloe Condon:

or the music or like about those

Jeremy Sinclair:

there's a lot of awesome sounds and the soundtrack itself is really great I've there's been days I've listened to the entire soundtrack of it just doing work

Unknown:

like that so

Jeremy Sinclair:

be definitely want to tap into

Chloe Condon:

I saw an anime in theaters recently that I'm sure you're familiar with Jeremy called your name. It was like a body switching anime and it really made me think and I enjoyed it a lot more than I thought I would.

Unknown:

An interesting one. Yeah.

Chloe Condon:

I what I really enjoy about anime is it's very like stylized and can sometimes be very over the top but at the same time can make you think and really pull at your heartstrings. And I think there's an interesting parallel there with musical theater that like, very similar to anime, right that some people are like, oh, anime or musicals, but it's such a stylized over the top art form that on the one hand can make you laugh and cry, but like on the other hand, can like really get your brain going. Like my boyfriend likes a lot of anime and all that like goes to the show and things like that. We'll be watching this background like cyberpunk in.

Unknown:

Favorite.

Jeremy Sinclair:

I love those super psychological anime, where you get into you get into ethics. So you get into like the ethics of robots and the use of technology. This Fewster, futuristic, ethical anime, where it really gets you thinking, and they touch on it touch on so many subjects, not necessarily directly, but it always mirrors back the society, that God and think of that just gets me thinking like, Hmm, maybe I need to reevaluate some things that I thought of. Just because this gave me an idea of

Chloe Condon:

Yeah, we didn't need to make dannemann official questions, um, but brands on. Any Any other questions you have for Jeremy before we let him go today?

Brandon Minnick:

Well, let's see. So, I know,

Unknown:

Jeremy, you're

Brandon Minnick:

you're really plugged in. And for anybody watching again, I know we're telling you follow Jeremy on on Twitter, because

Chloe Condon:

always doing something.

Brandon Minnick:

It's amazing. If you didn't watch build, you would still know everything that happened just by following Jeremy on Twitter. So if you want to be plugged in to the dotnet ecosystem, in particular, Jeremy's your guy. So yeah, something I'm curious about Jeremy, what what's coming down the pike that you are most excited about?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Let's say one of the things I'm really excited about is seeing project reunion. And finally getting full arm 64 support for when UI three, and the release of dotnet five, because I know there's a lot of people who have WPS applications that they want to see run on the arm 64 devices. And if as soon as all of these platforms are targets available for arm 64, then they can cross compile, and make more apps available for me to use.

Brandon Minnick:

I'm really looking forward to that. And selfishly, for somebody like myself, who makes iOS and Android apps that also run on ARM 64 processors, but is, again, selfishly good for me is with dotnet focusing more on ARM 64 there's gonna be more optimizations coming. And so without having to write any code, I can just recompile the app and it'll run faster.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yeah, there's there's been a lot of work and I love reading the blog posts about all of the optimizations for arm 64 I'm just like, wow, this is this is phenomenal. And so yeah, you're done. Gets me really happy because I want to see things run faster, even though it runs fast enough for me like the I love that there's a focus, it's not being left behind it's people are making sure that the proper fixes the proper additions to make this platform run better. It's it's happening. So big shout out to everyone involved with that.

Brandon Minnick:

Certainly

Chloe Condon:

we have someone in the chat that just said yes project reunion blew my mind that build.

Brandon Minnick:

Yeah, he's just gonna say, Jeremy for anybody at home who hasn't heard for union? What's a quick one two sentence soundbite or summary of what what the project is?

Chloe Condon:

It's not the project run, right? reunion, just

Brandon Minnick:

not yet. Not yet.

Jeremy Sinclair:

So we think of project reunion, it's the, I guess, the unification of what you would see as win 32 and you WP that, you know that monitors is kind of going away, like, okay, here's the Windows app. So you're gonna have a different style of this different style of that. But you're seeing that API just kind of merge across the board, it's going to, it's going to be abstracted enough that this API is going to be available across all these project types. So it's, I see it as that real kind of unification of the Windows platform

Brandon Minnick:

for developers. And let's be honest, finally. There's always, it's always been this. I don't wanna say a battle because it makes it sound like it's anything antagonistic. It's not it's just we have so many amazing tools at Microsoft for working with windows that, you know, the question always comes up, it's like, Okay, well, which one should I use? And which ones which one's better? Which one's best? It's not necessarily that one is absolutely better than all the others, some are better at certain things. But yeah, being able to unify all that is such a dream. And same with dotnet five is going to be unifying more things when it comes to dotnet dotnet core motto it's, it's it's a beautiful bright future for us as dotnet developers. So if you're, if you're watching at home and you're not using dotnet or C sharp yet, what are you waiting for?

Jeremy Sinclair:

When you do start?

Brandon Minnick:

Get started today?

Jeremy Sinclair:

Yes, this this was one of my one of my thoughts, any ideas you have? immediately write them down? It doesn't matter what type of idea it is. Write it down and research everything you can to make it happen.

Chloe Condon:

Yeah, well Jeremy, we've got your Twitter here on underneath your name where people can follow you but are there other spaces that people should be keeping an eye out for your awesome updates and work that you're doing out there on all the windows and dotnet things?

Jeremy Sinclair:

If there's anything it'll likely come through Twitter first

Chloe Condon:

What are all right yeah,

Unknown:

everybody

Chloe Condon:

follow Jeremy now and Jeremy it's been so wonderful to have you on today. I was just thinking my windows literally in real life are very gloomy today. But you have brought positive windows into my life today. So thank you.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Thank you to like to do for the smiley faces and get everyone happy split. It's all about

Chloe Condon:

and I'm sad that we didn't get to see each other in person this year at Ignite or build but at least we have learned TV and Twitch.

Jeremy Sinclair:

Absolutely.

Chloe Condon:

Alrighty, well. That is the end of our show for today. Thank you all so so so much for joining us live and for all the great questions. We got some really great questions this time. And we will see y'all next week. So from me Chloe and point the right way has been eight beds by